Holding unpopular views

Started by Alpine, October 13, 2008, 12:34:10 pm

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Alpine

It seems like almost everything I believe is unpopular.

[HIGHLIGHT=#ffff00]I believe that we can fall away - but it's a hard thing to do.
I believe the gifts of the Spirit are for today.
I believe that the pre-trib rapture is found nowhere in scripture.
I believe in creationism.
I believe in politically conservative ideas. Though, I am not an arch-conservative. I'm more to the middle now from where I used to be.
[/HIGHLIGHT]


I almost always feel like in some ways on the defensive when it comes to my ideas.

Many of my views are not straight down the line standard evangelical views. So, on Christian forums, I am often on the defensive about something.

I came from a home that was very democratic. I rebelled by becoming a Republican. So, that's always been troublesome.

I was just thinking, it would of just been so much easier to just believe what everyone else believes. No more having to make long arguments about why I believe why I believe.

But, then, I guess I wouldn't be me anymore would I?


Anyone else ever feel like this?
As long as the Steelers themes smileys exist so shall my protest last!

flaglady

 
Quote from: Alpine on October 13, 2008, 12:34:10 pm
It seems like almost everything I believe is unpopular.

[HIGHLIGHT=#ffff00][HIGHLIGHT=#fac08f]I believe that we can fall away - but it's a hard thing to do. [/HIGHLIGHT]
[HIGHLIGHT=#fac08f]I believe the gifts of the Spirit are for today. [/HIGHLIGHT]
[HIGHLIGHT=#fac08f]I believe that the pre-trib rapture is found nowhere in scripture.[/HIGHLIGHT]
I believe in creationism.
I believe in politically conservative ideas. Though, I am not an arch-conservative. I'm more to the middle now from where I used to be.
[/HIGHLIGHT]

Anyone else ever feel like this?


Suppose I go along with three of your beliefs but I have trouble trying to understand that if creationism is a fact, why did God bother to pepper the planet with dinosaur bones?!!

And I have no idea what it means to be conservative or liberal - except liberals seem to be able to ignore the 'sin' bit of homosexuality.   Anyway, twould be an awful boring world if we all thought/felt/believed the same, doncha think?

Viv la differance!

Alpine

Quote from: MissConStru on October 13, 2008, 12:51:16 pm

Suppose I go along with three of your beliefs but I have trouble trying to understand that if creationism is a fact, why did God bother to pepper the planet with dinosaur bones?!!

And I have no idea what it means to be conservative or liberal - except liberals seem to be able to ignore the 'sin' bit of homosexuality.






Cause the dinosaurs died? lol

The difference between liberals and conservatives is that liberals gave up. Which is why they generally support the legality of just about everything.
As long as the Steelers themes smileys exist so shall my protest last!

Pete

Quote from: Alpine on October 13, 2008, 12:34:10 pm

I almost always feel like in some ways on the defensive when it comes to my ideas.



I know exactly what you mean.  Especially on CF, I was all about defending my beliefs.  Until one day, God spoke to me and said, "You don't have to defend your beliefs to anyone.  Demonstrate what you believe, instead of defending it."

The example I gave in another thread fits well here also.  If someone calls me a liar, I needn't stand up and say "I'm not a liar!"  All I need to do is not lie.  IOW, not defend the fact that I'm not a liar.  DEMONSTRATE that I'm not a liar.

I think there's something in us that has a desire for acceptance and approval, whether we'll admit it or not, and we desire to be seen as justified in our beliefs in the eyes of others.  That's why when someone says something that goes against our beliefs, we tend to respond in a defensive manner, because we are seeking to justify what we believe to them.

But it is neither our purpose nor or responsibility to make people accept any belief, religious, political or otherwise.  I wish I could describe the peace I found when God revealed this Truth to me.

We have to come to the understanding that it is the Holy Spirit alone that guides people to the Truth.  All we can do is profess and LIVE that Truth that has been revealed to us, and allow the Spirit to guide people to the Truth.
"There is no charge for awesomeness -- or attractiveness."

Alpine

Quote from: Pete on October 13, 2008, 01:19:59 pm
I know exactly what you mean.  Especially on CF, I was all about defending my beliefs.  Until one day, God spoke to me and said, "You don't have to defend your beliefs to anyone.  Demonstrate what you believe, instead of defending it."

The example I gave in another thread fits well here also.  If someone calls me a liar, I needn't stand up and say "I'm not a liar!"  All I need to do is not lie.  IOW, not defend the fact that I'm not a liar.  DEMONSTRATE that I'm not a liar.

I think there's something in us that has a desire for acceptance and approval, whether we'll admit it or not, and we desire to be seen as justified in our beliefs in the eyes of others.  That's why when someone says something that goes against our beliefs, we tend to respond in a defensive manner, because we are seeking to justify what we believe to them.

But it is neither our purpose nor or responsibility to make people accept any belief, religious, political or otherwise.  I wish I could describe the peace I found when God revealed this Truth to me.

We have to come to the understanding that it is the Holy Spirit alone that guides people to the Truth.  All we can do is profess and LIVE that Truth that has been revealed to us, and allow the Spirit to guide people to the Truth.



Interesting points.
As long as the Steelers themes smileys exist so shall my protest last!

DianeL

I agree with you Pete, under those similar standards and my behaviour, someone I know accepted Jesus as her Savior.
34
A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another; as I have loved you, that you also love one another.
35
By this all will know that you are My disciples, if you have love for one another. John 13

Hisgirl

Quote from: MissConStru on October 13, 2008, 12:51:16 pm

Suppose I go along with three of your beliefs but I have trouble trying to understand that if creationism is a fact, why did God bother to pepper the planet with dinosaur bones?!!

And I have no idea what it means to be conservative or liberal - except liberals seem to be able to ignore the 'sin' bit of homosexuality.   Anyway, twould be an awful boring world if we all thought/felt/believed the same, doncha think?

Viv la differance!



Jo, I believe in creationism and also believe the earth was once covered in dinosaurs.  I don't believe God created the earth in six 24-hour days.  I don't find scripture to suport that notion.  There is however a verse that says one day to God is one thousand years to man..or something like that.    It wouldn't surprise me if dinosaurs were around when early man was around and then they died in the flood.   
"It's better to have it and not need it, than to need it and not have it."  My Mama

The Lord is my banner

Quote from: Hisgirl on October 13, 2008, 02:18:27 pm


I don't believe God created the earth in six 24-hour days.  I don't find scripture to suport that notion. 


I do!  :)

It says in Genesis that God did this or that and it was evening and then morning - sounds like a day means a day!

Just a thought, but if a Genesis day was greatly longer than an actual day - how did the plants grow with no sun until the following day

(Uh-oh!  Did I start a creation debate?     Quick, run away! )


churchlady

Quote from: Alpine on October 13, 2008, 12:34:10 pm
It seems like almost everything I believe is unpopular.

[HIGHLIGHT=#ffff00]I believe that we can fall away - but it's a hard thing to do.
I believe the gifts of the Spirit are for today.
I believe that the pre-trib rapture is found nowhere in scripture.
I believe in creationism.
I believe in politically conservative ideas. Though, I am not an arch-conservative. I'm more to the middle now from where I used to be.
[/HIGHLIGHT]


Anyone else ever feel like this?



Well everything you put in yellow, I totally agree with, so I find you most agreeable indeed. 
De Oppresso Liber

lovesblessing

Well, Vern, it's okay to believe what you want......everyone has that right, because God loves us all, and He gave us the right to choose what we believe and don't believe. 

What we believe affects how we live our lives and what is a part of our lives.  It is a human thing, not a christian thing, or a WoF thing, but a human being thing.  You know the scripture, "As a man thinks in his heart, so he is."   Works for the heathen and the christian, because it is a human quality that Father God placed in each of us.  Everyone is believing something about everything, whether they understand it or not.    And what we believe to be the truth, (even if it is a lie that we are decieved into thinking is the truth), will affect our words and actions and what happens in our lives.

The important thing that Father God showed me was this, that it doesn't matter what our opinions (beliefs) are about Jesus and Who He is and what He has done for us, the ultimate truth that defines everything in this universe it what God values who Jesus is and what Jesus did at the cross for us.  God will always be faithful to the finished work of the cross of Jesus and all that it means for every human being ever.

Real faith is having faith in the faithfulness of God......it is having a good opinion of Him.   That is true faith.   That is faith in God's righteousness, that is the Gospel of grace in Christ Jesus.

So, now what I really want to know about you Vern is this........is your best friend's name Ernest? 

Quote from: Alpine on October 13, 2008, 12:34:10 pm
It seems like almost everything I believe is unpopular.

[HIGHLIGHT=#ffff00]I believe that we can fall away - but it's a hard thing to do.
I believe the gifts of the Spirit are for today.
I believe that the pre-trib rapture is found nowhere in scripture.
I believe in creationism.
I believe in politically conservative ideas. Though, I am not an arch-conservative. I'm more to the middle now from where I used to be.
[/HIGHLIGHT]


I almost always feel like in some ways on the defensive when it comes to my ideas.

Many of my views are not straight down the line standard evangelical views. So, on Christian forums, I am often on the defensive about something.

I came from a home that was very democratic. I rebelled by becoming a Republican. So, that's always been troublesome.

I was just thinking, it would of just been so much easier to just believe what everyone else believes. No more having to make long arguments about why I believe why I believe.

But, then, I guess I wouldn't be me anymore would I?


Anyone else ever feel like this?
[/SIZE] [/COLOR][/FONT]
Faith is having a good opinion of God!


Alpine

Quote from: churchlady on October 13, 2008, 02:53:13 pm
Well everything you put in yellow, I totally agree with, so I find you most agreeable indeed. 


Oh! I'm not alone!

Quote from: lovesblessing on October 13, 2008, 03:25:39 pm

So, now what I really want to know about you Vern is this........is your best friend's name Ernest? 





Thanks for that word. Actually Ernest is my enemy. He ruined my life and for the rest of my life I will suffer indignity because of him.
As long as the Steelers themes smileys exist so shall my protest last!

8 iron

  You're believes are fairly normal.

Alpine

Quote from: 8 iron on October 13, 2008, 08:19:00 pm
  You're believes are fairly normal.



Trust me, if you go talk about this stuff to an average non christian joe, i wont come across as very normal. :-)
And I'm a distinct minority in every church I go too, they all seem to believe in the pre trib rapture...which makes end times sermons interesting...
As long as the Steelers themes smileys exist so shall my protest last!

Prosperity

Quote from: Alpine on October 13, 2008, 12:34:10 pm
It seems like almost everything I believe is unpopular.

[HIGHLIGHT=#ffff00]I believe that we can fall away - but it's a hard thing to do.
I believe the gifts of the Spirit are for today.
I believe that the pre-trib rapture is found nowhere in scripture.
I believe in creationism.
I believe in politically conservative ideas. Though, I am not an arch-conservative. I'm more to the middle now from where I used to be.
[/HIGHLIGHT]


I almost always feel like in some ways on the defensive when it comes to my ideas.

Many of my views are not straight down the line standard evangelical views. So, on Christian forums, I am often on the defensive about something.

I came from a home that was very democratic. I rebelled by becoming a Republican. So, that's always been troublesome.

I was just thinking, it would of just been so much easier to just believe what everyone else believes. No more having to make long arguments about why I believe why I believe.

But, then, I guess I wouldn't be me anymore would I?


Anyone else ever feel like this?


I can't identify with you because my views are always wildly popular, especially among Christians.  I am surprised you haven't noticed.  LOL

lovesblessing

Oh, my goodness, Vern!  I'm sorry......didn't mean to offend with the teasing about Ernest!   I suppose you have gotten pestered alot because of him......

I can feel your pain on this because my Mom gave me the nickname of "Dolly".......do you know how tired a person can get of hearing "Hello Dolly"?

Quote from: Alpine on October 13, 2008, 04:32:00 pm
Oh! I'm not alone!


Thanks for that word. Actually Ernest is my enemy. He ruined my life and for the rest of my life I will suffer indignity because of him.
[/SIZE] [/COLOR][/FONT]
Faith is having a good opinion of God!


leadworship

Alpine, my dear brother - I don't talk about those things with "non-christian joes".  Those are things that we as christians must resolve in ourselves, but none of them are points at which would or should bring someone to salvation.  I've argued with non-believers about certain points in the past... and it always got ugly.  Then one day God showed me that I need to shutup about it.  The unsaved need to hear of God's goodness and love and see it lived out, not be convinced.  They don't take things on faith like I do, so they won't.  Now, when someone wants to debate I just say, "Jesus didn't tell me debate every point, but to share the news about Him.  Sorry, I can't ablige you right now."  Sure saves me some stress!

Now, if I'm talking to other Christians, it's simply my own interpretation.  Kinda like my Pastor says from the pulpit, "Now, I believe... did you get that?  I'm about to tell you what I, Dale, believes, and I'll show you the scripture that prompts me to believe it as such, but it is what I believe, you take it as such..."  That's the way I see any of this.  One thing's for sure - nobody has it 100% right, but we'll all know 100% of it when we get there!

I believe we can fall away - and that it is hard, but not extremely difficult.
I believe the gifts of the Spirit are for today.
I believe that we were all created by Jesus - no matter the time frame.  God could do it in the twinkling of an eye or over 6000 years.  That's His judgement call.
I believe in mostly politically conservative ideas and am also a "middle of the roader".  I like some things about each candidate - but I'll vote based on the ones of highest moral and ethical value to me.

I'm not up to date on any tribulationary doctrines - I believe christians won't be here to suffer throught the tribulation - whereever that puts me.

Alpine

Prosperity you no doubt have won the Mr. popularity contest at some point in your life.  

lovesblessing, those who have not been mocked by their name cannot understand what it feels like to undergo such torture when you are young. This is why I will never name any of my children with a name that is an easy target for ridicule.

leadworship, I hear ya'. Generally I don't engage non Christians in deep disucssions concerning the finer points of the faith. But, sometimes those questions do come up. But, you're right on how we should treat non Christians.
As long as the Steelers themes smileys exist so shall my protest last!

sharonl

I will talk just so long and then I will say - well one thing is for certain - you'll know one second into eternity if you were right or wrong - if I'm wrong - I've lost nothing - if I'm right - I've earned eternity with my Savior.
Diamonds From Heaven - help for the hurting heart
http://gentle.org/sites/diamonds/
Beautiful gifts - the men love them http://chopsknives.com

Pete

Quote from: sharonl on October 15, 2008, 09:41:49 am
I will talk just so long and then I will say - well one thing is for certain - you'll know one second into eternity if you were right or wrong - if I'm wrong - I've lost nothing - if I'm right - I've earned eternity with my Savior.


:2thumbs:
"There is no charge for awesomeness -- or attractiveness."

Truth

 
Quote from: Alpine on October 13, 2008, 12:34:10 pm
It seems like almost everything I believe is unpopular.

[HIGHLIGHT=#ffff00]I believe that we can fall away - but it's a hard thing to do.
I believe the gifts of the Spirit are for today.
I believe that the pre-trib rapture is found nowhere in scripture.
I believe in creationism.
I believe in politically conservative ideas. Though, I am not an arch-conservative. I'm more to the middle now from where I used to be.
[/HIGHLIGHT]


I almost always feel like in some ways on the defensive when it comes to my ideas.

Many of my views are not straight down the line standard evangelical views. So, on Christian forums, I am often on the defensive about something.

I came from a home that was very democratic. I rebelled by becoming a Republican. So, that's always been troublesome.

I was just thinking, it would of just been so much easier to just believe what everyone else believes. No more having to make long arguments about why I believe why I believe.

But, then, I guess I wouldn't be me anymore would I?


Anyone else ever feel like this?


Everything I believe is probably even more unpopular than what you believe everywhere I go.  :doh:   So I can relate to that.

I part way agree with you.  ;)   So you're not completely alone.

I don't think we should compromise on our beliefs and  just go along with them but we don't have to argue either. Giving our opinion isn't necessarily arguing, but it depends on our atttiude and how we say it.


Quote from: Pete
I think there's something in us that has a desire for acceptance and approval, whether we'll admit it or not, and we desire to be seen as justified in our beliefs in the eyes of others.  That's why when someone says something that goes against our beliefs, we tend to respond in a defensive manner, because we are seeking to justify what we believe to them.

But it is neither our purpose nor or responsibility to make people accept any belief, religious, political or otherwise.  I wish I could describe the peace I found when God revealed this Truth to me.

We have to come to the understanding that it is the Holy Spirit alone that guides people to the Truth.  All we can do is profess and LIVE that Truth that has been revealed to us, and allow the Spirit to guide people to the Truth.


In some cases its defensiveness, but I don't think thats always the motive. I may just let it go, but sometimes I  want to share my view. Others times  if its a serious situation, I feel its my repsponsibility to give what I believe is the truth and ask the Lord to  reveal it to others reading. They need to hear both sides. That doesn't mean I need to get defensive, but  just present how I see it according to the Word of God.


Quote from: leadworship on October 14, 2008, 09:11:48 am
Alpine, my dear brother - I don't talk about those things with "non-christian joes".  Those are things that we as christians must resolve in ourselves, but none of them are points at which would or should bring someone to salvation.  I've argued with non-believers about certain points in the past... and it always got ugly.  Then one day God showed me that I need to shutup about it.  The unsaved need to hear of God's goodness and love and see it lived out, not be convinced.  They don't take things on faith like I do, so they won't.  Now, when someone wants to debate I just say, "Jesus didn't tell me debate every point, but to share the news about Him.  Sorry, I can't ablige you right now."  Sure saves me some stress!

Now, if I'm talking to other Christians, it's simply my own interpretation.  Kinda like my Pastor says from the pulpit, "Now, I believe... did you get that?  I'm about to tell you what I, Dale, believes, and I'll show you the scripture that prompts me to believe it as such, but it is what I believe, you take it as such..."  That's the way I see any of this.  One thing's for sure - nobody has it 100% right, but we'll all know 100% of it when we get there!

I believe we can fall away - and that it is hard, but not extremely difficult.
I believe the gifts of the Spirit are for today.
I believe that we were all created by Jesus - no matter the time frame.  God could do it in the twinkling of an eye or over 6000 years.  That's His judgement call.
I believe in mostly politically conservative ideas and am also a "middle of the roader".  I like some things about each candidate - but I'll vote based on the ones of highest moral and ethical value to me.

I'm not up to date on any tribulationary doctrines - I believe christians won't be here to suffer throught the tribulation - whereever that puts me.

Excellent post leadworship.   :2thumbs:
I haven't seen you around, I hope you are still here to post more like this