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Have you ever paid someone else's debt ?

Started by Yitzchak, June 20, 2011, 06:26:16 pm

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Yitzchak

   The other thread about God being angry got me thinking about this. God was angry at us and decided instead of punishing us to send Jesus to pay a debt that was not his to pay. I made the point in the other thread that the Gospel is about us showing grace and not just about us demanding grace. the Gospel is not about being selfish. If we really believe it , we will still believe to the point of it costing us something.

   Now I think sometimes we lose sight of what actually happened with Jesus. We separate it from our daily life. But to make it real to us , I would like to ask this question.

    Have you ever paid the debt of someone else for them ? What about a really big debt for someone who was your enemy or someone who had mistreated you ? Like your ex who totally wronged you ? Would you ever show grace to your enemy ?


       Way back when I was 18 years old I lived with some room mates and we split the phone bill. One day our phone was disconnected. It came as a surprise to all of us except the one room mate who we all gave the money to and said he was paying the phone bill.  He had been using the money to buy other stuff and not paying the phone bill. He also had intercepted the mail and so we never knew until the phone was disconnected and we owed 600 dollars to get it reconnected because some of us had made long distance calls. Back in 1984 when this happened , 600 dollars was a whole lot of money for a bunch of 18 and19 year olds.

     We had a meeting and we decided that this guy should pay it back somehow but the problem was he did not have the money. So one of the room mates payed it for him. they used their money that they had saved up for vacation by working overtime. They also did not ask him to pay it back because they knew he struggled paycheck to paycheck and it would be a big burden to put on him. The rest of us wanted justice but since it was paid and the problem solved , we let it go.

    So would you pay the debt of someone who totally does not deserve it ? Would you do it if you knew they would go back and make the same wrong choices again ? Would you do it for a stranger who could never pay you back ? Would you sell your second car or give up your vacation for thousands of dollars or just be willing to show grace if it was a dollar or two ?

   How much do we believe in grace when we are the ones who it is costing something ?
To know him and to make him known

sharonl

Yes I have done it several times.  My best friend was struggling and I paid several times to get her out of a mess to the tune of over $3,000. Did this with my husband being very upset because I really felt she would pay it back.  Well it is now 18 years later and I have tried to drop it because I felt the friendship was better than the $3,000.  Well she still is not a good friend because she feels guilty for not paying me back even though she inherited $250,000 - my husband can't even see the name of that person come up at any time without making a comment.

Sometimes we think we are helping, but actually we are adding to their problems.
Diamonds From Heaven - help for the hurting heart
http://gentle.org/sites/diamonds/
Beautiful gifts - the men love them http://chopsknives.com

Pete

Yitzchak, you may find this thread that I wrote last year interesting;

When agendas attack

...and also this thread;

Forgiveness; a debt we could never repay on our own

O0
"There is no charge for awesomeness -- or attractiveness."

Supplanter

I'll simply say I live out grace without going into much detail. The cost of what I have given or sacrificed whether it be a million dollars, my life, or my last two pennies has still been small in comparison to the grace and blessings I have received. But the thing about grace is that, it isn't meant to be repaid, that is why it is grace because you can't afford the debt and yet because of the love it inspires in  us when we truly know God for who He is, we can't help but give all of ourselves and resources to please Him and show that love to others.

DianeL

A few months ago, I was walking out of a store, there was a young girl there probably about 16 yrs or around that, bad bleach hair job, dressed for spring with running shoes on, it was winter here.

She asked for money (this never happened before to me outside this store), I looked at her realizing she was speaking to me. Then she said, it's for food, it didn't matter, I reached into my purse for change, and in the split second, I thought Di, don't be stupid, so I pulled my change purse out which I knew had lots of $1 and $2 coins in it and handed her the entire change purse, plopped it in her hand and said, that's all I have, have a great day!

She looked at me through glazed eyes, said a quick thank you and took off, I didn't look back.

On my way home, my brain starts thinking, 'what if I've been conned', I don't have a lot of money myself, then I started talking with God, by the time I got home, I was nearly in tears thinking I'd not given her enough, regardless of what she might do with the money, it wasn't enough. She needs help. Maybe not just with money.

I might have had a $5 bill in my purse, I don't have a lot of money and don't carry much money either. My truck is a 1994 toyoto 4-runner but it runs well. I just thought I could have done more.

If she was conning me, what brought her to that place where she felt she needed to ask for money, she wasn't dressed warm for the weather. She looked like she'd slept on a uncomfortable couch.

It changed my thinking about some things, and about giving in Jesus's name because on my own, I probably wouldn't have done this as freely and of course with wisdom.

34
A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another; as I have loved you, that you also love one another.
35
By this all will know that you are My disciples, if you have love for one another. John 13

sharonl

This is a good thread - just wanted to revive it.

My friend I spoke of before that owes me $3,000 - still will not have anything to do with me - I've tried, phone, e-mails and Facebook - but she has such guilt (and I do not bring up the money) that she cannot be friends.  This was the best friend I have ever had and I miss her. So we don't always do the right thing, I would still be friends today if I had not given her the money.
Diamonds From Heaven - help for the hurting heart
http://gentle.org/sites/diamonds/
Beautiful gifts - the men love them http://chopsknives.com

DiscipleWhomJesusLoves

I believe that we need the Lord's leading when doing such things. It shouldn't be a law: Thou shalt give to every person in need when asked.

I mean, what if someone had given some money to the prodigal son when he was in the pig pen? Would it have spoiled what God was doing in him? Would he have returned to the father, or stayed out longer?

As for lending money to friends and family, it's sometimes one of the best ways to ruin the relationship. If you have to do it, do it without expecting to get your money back.

sharonl

When I give, I like to give without the people knowing for this very reason that it sometimes does more harm than good.  My husband gets put out with me.  He told me once that when I get to Heaven, God is going to have this long scroll and show me, well I had these people right where I wanted them and they were about to turn the corner to draw closer to me and you come alone and pick them up - now they have to go around that mountain again.

I never learn - when I see people in trouble the first thing I think of is 'how can I help.' My big problem is I help them so much they become dependent on me and then I get upset - but it is my own fault.

It's not always the best thing to do and we need to have wisdom, which I never do. When I go visit my children, I'll slip some money in a spot they will find later and not know where it came from. I am the biggest pushover around.
Diamonds From Heaven - help for the hurting heart
http://gentle.org/sites/diamonds/
Beautiful gifts - the men love them http://chopsknives.com

DiscipleHeLovesToo

in all things be led; give as you purpose in your heart.  we are spirit soul and body, and the heart is the agreement of the soul (mind, will and emotions) and the body (flesh - 'evil heart') or the soul and the Spirit (Holy Spirit - a 'perfect' or complete heart), so giving is always right when your heart is 'perfect', and always wrong when your heart is 'evil' - in all things be led by the Spirit of God.

the effect of giving with a perfect heart may not be evident right away; but if God is leading, it will eventually have the positive effect He knows it will - else He wouldn't lead someone to give.  yes, i've given to people who did me wrong - but i believe by faith that i was led to do so - so i was actually giving to God, and it was Him that gave to the other person - i was just the delivery boy.

GLY!!!
Joh 17:3  And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.