Started by JTM³, March 24, 2009, 11:32:29 pm
Quote 1 : responsive to or conscious of sense impressions <sentient beings> 2 : aware 3 : finely sensitive in perception or feeling2 : aware 3 : finely sensitive in perception or feeling
Quote-adjective 1.having the power of perception by the senses; conscious.2.characterized by sensation and consciousness.-noun 3.a person or thing that is sentient.4.Archaic. the conscious mind.
Quote from: JJ on March 25, 2009, 04:12:35 amWe are spirit, soul, and body. An animal for instance a pet, each has a personality. You will notice they are all different if you've had several dogs, even if its the same kind. But he only have a body and soul, which is the mind, intellect , feelings, will. But he doesn't have a spirit. I don't think sentience is merely a function of the physical. Since we are a spirit, if we are sensitive to the Spirit of God within us the soul and spirit works together. The soul will side with the flesh if we would rather do that than follow the Spirit of God. Our soul is neutral and will go along with which other one is strongest.
Quote from: Pete on March 25, 2009, 10:23:17 amIt sounds like you're asking if artificial intelligence (AI) is a possibility...Computers can only do what they are programmed to do. They can "learn" things over time by "watching" (collecting data), but they can't reprogram themselves beyond what the limitations of the original program allows for. In this sense, they are not "sentient", because they don't have reasoning abilities. They can only look at their data sets (which can be quite large) and make "decisions" based on the program inside of them (which can create the illusion of "intelligence"). The program can appear to become "smarter" as the data set increases, but really it just has more data to work with, and so it's able to "predict" (guess) with a higher probability of being correct.When I write computer programs, as the programmer, I have to take into account everything a user might do. For example, if a field in a dialog box is expecting a numerical value and you type a text string, as the programmer I have to "handle" that situation and respond accordingly. If I don't, the computer is not going to understand what it's supposed to do. That's one of the greatest challenges a programmer faces; trying to account for every possible scenario. If a computer were sentient, it could look at the input value and "reason" that it needs a number instead of a text string. But I don't ever see that happening.There is something unique in living beings that creates that sentience. JJ raises a good point. An animal doesn't have a spirit, but an animal is quite sentient. They are very much aware of their surroundings, and their decision making process is highly affected by what is happening in those surroundings. They are able to reason, because they have a soul. They have an "instinct" that God placed in them for this purpose.A computer can't see that you're about to hit it with a hammer and do something to intervene and stop you. But an animal can.So I believe that our sentience comes from our mind and intellect, which is not directly tied to our spirit. That is why we are instructed in scripture to renew our minds, so that it will listen to the Spirit of God.
Quote from: JTM3 on March 25, 2009, 11:43:58 amThat's the point though, if sentience is derived from the physical and not the spiritual, then someone could someday devise an artificial sentience. If our personalities, our emotions and our intellect are all physical, then it merely requires the understanding of each to develop computer algorithms or some type of machine that can learn and experience all these things itself.
Quote from: Pete on March 25, 2009, 12:00:49 pmHere's the problem though. What you are describing is a larger data set for the computer. More algorithms for the computer to choose from. This is still not "intelligence". It requires a programmer to create those algorithms. If a programmer misses something, it is nearly inconceivable that a computer could "reason" to create its own algorithm. IOW, a computer program can only do what it is programmed to do.That's what would denote "intelligence"; the computer doing something that it was NOT originally programmed to do.Let's take a real simple example. When you shop at Amazon, it "watches" (collects data) about the things you view and purchase. It records and prioritizes how much time you spend viewing certain items, and from that it is able to make suggestions (educated guesses) about what other products you might like. But for that to happen, the web programmers at Amazon have to feed it the data for EACH product, so that it can compare similar keywords, etc. to come up with that list of "suggestions".To the uninformed, this appears to be the computer "gaining intelligence" about what you like, but really, it's just a nifty in-line search engine, "learning" what you like to look at based upon the data you unwittingly provide with your browsing. The programmers then are able to tell the computer to use that data to predict the probability that you will find another, similar, product interesting.Netflix does the same thing. That's why they ask me to rate movies all the time, because the more data I provide to their service, the more likely they are to be able to correctly guess what kind of movie I might enjoy. The suggestions appear to be "smarter".As groovy as that all is, it is not "intelligence" The computer is doing just what it was programmed to do and nothing more. Until a computer is able to "think", or rather, look at a specific circumstance and reprogram itself, the notion of AI is incredibly unlikely.
Quote from: JTM3 on March 25, 2009, 11:43:58 amThat's the point though, if sentience is derived from the physical and not the spiritual, then someone could someday devise an artificial sentience. If our personalities, our emotions and our intellect are all physical, then it merely requires the understanding of each to develop computer algorithms or some type of machine that can learn and experience all these things itself. The point is, if these things are purely physical in nature, and not spiritual, they will be eventually understood by science, and science WILL be able to produce artificial sentience. I believe its called "irreducible complexity" or something. Just don't give it control of military....
Quote from: Wordsmith on March 25, 2009, 01:17:29 pmSo a computer is only as good as the human that programs it.
Quote from: Wordsmith on March 25, 2009, 01:17:29 pmWhat happens to the human element of decision making? Say..5 people have the same problem, but not all those 5 people have the same special set of circumstances that created it. Will a computer come up with the same answer, for all 5 people, regardless of the human element of dealing with people? How does a computer have the ability to show grace, love, concern, forgiveness etc..That's a scarey thought. To me that is just a machine that can only answer yes, or no, minus the human element.
Quote from: lovesblessing on March 25, 2009, 01:30:51 pmExcuse me for butting in here.....but......animals have a spirit of some type, because in Genesis the Lord said that he would hold the animals responsible for the death of a human being. If they don't have a spirit life of some sort, why would God say that? Just because they aren't in the same class as human beings, doesn't mean they don't have spirits. Angels are a different class of spirit life than humans.....does that mean they don't really have a spirit too?
QuoteBack to your original comment, the computer is only as good as the person that programs it. The reason I see true AI as an impossibility is because one would need to duplicate God's "design". I just don't see that happening.
Quote from: Pete on March 25, 2009, 01:36:01 pmIt's probably more accurate, like you said, to say that animals have a spirit life, but not equivalent to the spirit life of human beings.
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