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April 02, 2020, 05:49:59 pm

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21
General Discussion / Re: How to approach the Corona...
Last post by flaglady - March 10, 2020, 08:14:33 am
Quote from: Bryan on March 07, 2020, 11:11:11 pmSo my take is the disease may be dangerous to those who catch it, but how likely is that to happen?
It might be easy to catch it but given you're not in an 'at risk' group, it shouldn't be any worse than a mild to moderate cold. However, we should all be aware that, as I said previously, the hazard of this virus is that it's totally new, only launched itself n the human race late last year and there are lots of things we don't know about it, like

  • the incubation period
  • the manner of its transmission between people
  • how long it lasts for in humans
  • what the life span of the affect is
  • how it will change or transmute as the seasons change
  • what its mode of mutation is.

All these things are known about ordinary cold bugs, influenza and many other infections, both viral and bacterial.
22
General Discussion / Re: Christianity and Trump
Last post by Pete - March 09, 2020, 08:23:52 am
I honestly don't know who I'm going to vote for, but in my opinion, abortion shouldn't even be a politicized issue.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinions and views, but I personally don't think it's wise to vote solely on one issue. For some, it's homosexual marriage. For many, it's abortion. For many others, it's the economy (stupid).

The problem with that is that once a candidate knows the hot button issue, they can exploit it for their own personal and political gain. Mr. Trump knows that his comments on abortion will mobilize a large section of the voting base. So naturally, he "supports" repealing Roe v. Wade, despite having a history of saying he was pro-choice in every way, at least until it was no longer politically expedient to hold that viewpoint.

And this is why I hate politics. From my perspective, NO ONE in politics has any character or integrity. They just pander to whatever they think people want to hear without any real conviction. And I guess what bothers me is that I character and integrity is my take a stand issue. While suddenly it has become irrelevant to much of evangelical Christianity, it is of the utmost importance to me.

Please don't think this means I'm suggesting any other candidate has any integrity or character. But I think in large part, evangelical Christianity has sent the message loud and clear to Washington that as long as you say you're against abortion, we really don't care about anything else.

It would be another interesting discussion to talk about why abortion is such a hot button issue in the first place. I personally believe that abortion should be a medical issue, not a political one. Maybe I'll start another discussion on that topic. 

O0
23
General Discussion / Re: How to approach the Corona...
Last post by jiminpa - March 08, 2020, 09:38:18 am
Wash your hands, increase your vitamin C and antioxidants and go about your day. It goes back to what I said in the Trump thread. The media lets us know what is best for their agenda for us to know. They need a disease scare and here it is, the next big plaque.
24
General Discussion / Re: How to approach the Corona...
Last post by Bryan - March 07, 2020, 11:11:11 pm
So my take is the disease may be dangerous to those who catch it, but how likely is that to happen?

In China, a country with 1.4 BILLION people, only 80,000 people contracted it.  That equates to roughly .00005% of a chance in China.

I am not buying into the panic.  When the swine flu was a thing 10 years ago, it died out.  Ebola was supposed to kill everyone, didn't happen.
25
General Discussion / Re: How to approach the Corona...
Last post by flaglady - March 07, 2020, 04:19:54 pm
Quote from: LittleRocketBoy on March 06, 2020, 11:13:08 pmThis is not the flu.
You see, this is exactly what people do - I never said it was flu, I said it was a virus similar to flu but different in that it's "brand spanking new and nobody knows how it works, how it grows or how it can affect the human beings." That's what makes it dangerous.

Read my post again and see what I REALLY said!


Quote from: LittleRocketBoy on March 06, 2020, 11:13:08 pmThat's still much higher than the flu
I can't speak for what happens in the US but in the UK it's certain that several thousand die each year from seasonal influenza yet this is hardly ever spoken about. ONE person dies from COVID-19 and it's major headlines all over the country! What is not headlined is the thousands of people who get this infection and recover from it without a problem. But they are mostly young to middle-aged persons who are in good health.

Quote from: LittleRocketBoy on March 06, 2020, 11:13:08 pmI think it is dangerous to downplay this disease. Especially for the seniors and chronically ill.

Now there I agree with you 100%. As I believe I said previously, it is dangerous because it's a new and totally unknown virus. People have no immunity to it as yet and the vaccine won't be available until later in the year. All these things do make it serious. I also said that it is dangerous to people (like myself) who are over 60 and have co-morbidities such as diabetes (me), asthma, chronic bronchitis or COPD. These do comprise a very small percentage of the population and just like a cold or mild flu - as I said before - most people that get infected with COVID-19 will recover from it just as they would from a moderate common cold.

The most important issue is taking precautions like washing hands (as per the chart) but frequently, like every hour or so. I was in a shop today and the check-out lady coughed, covering her mouth with her hand. When I mentioned it to her, suggesting she should have coughed into the crook of her elbow, she said she had hand sanitiser but had made no effort to use it after she coughed! I shall ring the store on Monday and speak to the manager, maybe even offer to give his staff a little educational talk if he feels it necessary or appropriate!
26
General Discussion / Re: How to approach the Corona...
Last post by flaglady - March 07, 2020, 04:01:47 pm


....
27
General Discussion / Re: How to approach the Corona...
Last post by LittleRocketBoy - March 06, 2020, 11:13:08 pm
Actually a report came out today stating that COVID 19 is 34 times as likely to kill the victim... especially if they are over 60 or if they have other health issues.
This is not the flu.

"So how deadly is it to individuals? "Globally, about 3.4 percent of reported COVID-19 cases have died," said Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus, the World Health Organization's director, on March 3. That's still much higher than the flu (0.1 percent) but lower than SARS (10 percent), MERS (34 percent), or Ebola (50 percent). "

https://www.outsideonline.com/2409996/coronavirus-covid-19-facts
https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/03/who-says-coronavirus-death-rate-is-3point4percent-globally-higher-than-previously-thought.html


It is possible that up to 70% of the world population will catch COVID 19.
Deaths may reach as high as 136 million people.

I think it is dangerous to downplay this disease. Especially for the seniors and chronically ill.
28
General Discussion / Re: Christianity and Trump
Last post by Bryan - March 06, 2020, 01:48:27 pm
I feel the 2 party system that is in place right now in America is a big reason for such issues.  I truly do.  It leads to the conclusion of "If I don't vote, or if I don't vote for this candidate it's a vote for the other."  Specifically, because only a Republican or Democrat stands a chance at ever winning under the current format.

Even Theodore Roosevelt who is on Mount Rushmore lost a Presidential election under a third party ticket.  Now having multiple political parties vying for power can be just as bad, it always extremist groups to gain positions of power, etc, but I do feel the two-party system is lacking.

For instance, take Pete's discussion point.  President Trump lacks character and integrity.  If we decide we aren't voting for him because of these traits, who then should we vote for?  In the last election, Hillary Clinton was hardly the shining beacon of morality.  In the coming election, we will have to decide between Trump again or Bernie Sanders (a man that speaks well, but whose policies are almost certain to lead to financial chaos) or Joe Biden who is currently under Senate Investigation himself.  Not voting for anyone is probably the best play in that case.

Myself?  I will vote for the candidate that best represents my expectations.  Trump isn't perfect.  The man has his flaws.  But from my purview, he has done pretty well for the country and the people as a whole.  He is on the side of life, an issue that I cannot compromise on.  As such, I could never vote for a Democrat or a politician that openly supports abortion.  That is my take a stand issue.  Since he has voiced his disagreement with it and lack of support for it, then he has my vote.
29
General Discussion / Re: Christianity and Trump
Last post by Pete - March 06, 2020, 08:40:55 am
Quote from: jiminpa on March 05, 2020, 11:36:08 pmThe thing about the opinion pieces is that too many people are not distinguishing between opinion and news, and these elitists love that. They know that they can lie through their teeth, slap and opinion tag on it, but use factual wording, and Trump will now be a racist and misogynist, whether he is or not.

I'm going to place the burden for people knowing the difference between opinion and news on the people reading it. Many people share the same opinion, many don't. But that's really irrelevant. Opinion pieces are just that, opinion, not news.

Besides that, the worst one lying through his teeth is Mr. Trump, and I'm genuinely not trying to be accusatory toward you, but you don't seem to care. Why does Mr. Trump get a pass on the lies?

Quote from: jiminpa on March 05, 2020, 11:36:08 pmConcerning his Article 2 statement. I don't see the article granting him extraordinary power, and he is citing the constitution so unless he actually crosses the line, that one statement doesn't make him a totalitarian, especially when he is pressing for laws that gut his own power base.

I can only imagine the indignation and outrage if Mr. Obama had declared during a speech, "I can do whatever I want."

You're correct in that one that statement doesn't make him a totalitarian, but the sum of his words and actions over the past three years sure point in that direction. Also, saying "I can do whatever I want" is not citing the Constitution any more than someone saying that they're citing that John 3:16 says Jesus is a real cool dude. The two bear absolutely no resemblance.

Quote from: jiminpa on March 05, 2020, 11:36:08 pmThe thing is that as much as we may hate his mouth and his social media antics, the guy is probably the most constitutionally compliant president in my lifetime.

Name any law that he has initiated, or advanced that exceeds the limits of the constitution. I would argue that he has signed budgets that are way illegal, but his options are limited, since there is no possible way Congress will give him a constitutional budget. There's the irony, the first president in 100 years not to trample all over the constitution and people are afraid he's a tyrant.

I guess this is where our different ways of thinking become equivalent to speaking different languages, to me the filtering, (gatekeeping), and deceptiveness of the media is as plain as the water at the ocean, (or The Point, for us Western Pennsylvanians), and I genuinely don't understand how anyone can not see it. That doesn't just apply to Trump either. I've noticed it since 1982. It's the world's system being the world's system. They have absolute control of the information gateways and we see only what they show us.

That's why I suggested we look at news articles you believe are "attacking" Mr. Trump. Because to me, it's the exact opposite. The corruption and deception of the Trump administration are as plain to me as the sun shining in the sky, and I genuinely don't understand how anyone can not see it. I'm not suggesting the media is perfect, but I do suspect that you and I would likely have very different opinions of what constitutes an "attack".

And that brings me back to my OP. I truly believe that by excusing and endorsing Mr. Trump, Christians are willingly destroying their witness. For me, the double standard is astoundingly obvious. The precedents that Mr. Trump is setting in office by obstructing any and all oversight should be concerning to everyone. Eventually, the political power will swing, as it always does, and it will be pretty difficult for Christians to suddenly call for checks and balances when they've allowed and even cheered Mr. Trump's unilateral approach to government. It's hard for me to believe that if Mr. Obama did some of the same things that Mr. Trump does that these same people would just sit quietly and say nothing about it.

Christians suddenly don't care that Mr. Trump has no moral character, no integrity, no values. After screaming for years about how important it is to have a leader with character, now it's like, eh, not so important. And the world sees that.

It seems to me that Christianity and politics have never been about character and integrity despite that being the battle cry for so long. It's always been about voting for the guy that will keep them in power, at any cost. The facade that Christianity cares about the moral fiber of its leaders has been completely destroyed by the Trump administration.

Lindsey Graham tweeted it best when he said on May 3, 2016, "If we nominate Trump, we will get destroyed.......and we will deserve it."

O0
30
General Discussion / Re: Christianity and Trump
Last post by jiminpa - March 05, 2020, 11:36:08 pm
The thing about the opinion pieces is that too many people are not distinguishing between opinion and news, and these elitists love that. They know that they can lie through their teeth, slap and opinion tag on it, but use factual wording, and Trump will now be a racist and misogynist, whether he is or not.

Concerning his Article 2 statement. I don't see the article granting him extraordinary power, and he is citing the constitution so unless he actually crosses the line, that one statement doesn't make him a totalitarian, especially when he is pressing for laws that gut his own power base.

The thing is that as much as we may hate his mouth and his social media antics, the guy is probably the most constitutionally compliant president in my lifetime.

Name any law that he has initiated, or advanced that exceeds the limits of the constitution. I would argue that he has signed budgets that are way illegal, but his options are limited, since there is no possible way Congress will give him a constitutional budget. There's the irony, the first president in 100 years not to trample all over the constitution and people are afraid he's a tyrant. 

I guess this is where our different ways of thinking become equivalent to speaking different languages, to me the filtering, (gatekeeping), and deceptiveness of the media is as plain as the water at the ocean, (or The Point, for us Western Pennsylvanians), and I genuinely don't understand how anyone can not see it. That doesn't just apply to Trump either. I've noticed it since 1982. It's the world's system being the world's system. They have absolute control of the information gateways and we see only what they show us.

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